Christians are jerks online.
Discussion in 'News / Current Events' started by jaigner, Jun 30, 2010.
Check this article out. I think it's pretty accurate.
I read this yesterday...I laughed and thought of, well, alot...
I think it is the same mindset of the rude, arrogant, and cheap way the after church crowd treats waitresses for the Sunday noon meal. Compared to other customers, they are the worst. My daughter worked at a Chinese restaurant in college, and they would literally have knock-down, drag out fights about who had to work the Sunday shift. I won't tell anyone what happens to the food of the worst offenders.
I guess I appreciate where this guy is coming from, maybe he has been a jerk. But if you tell people the truth, in the most loving and kind way, or just straightforward and blunt, with the all the love in your heart...your going to get called a jerk, or worse, just because they don't agree with you. So, if this guy wants to repent of his negative online attitudes toward people, well, ok. But if he is rather criticizing Christians who whether in person or online tell people they are sinners and only Jesus Christ can save them, well...then the man needs to learn the Gospel. And maybe I would be called a jerk for saying that. :laugh:
I think it is the same mindset of the rude, arrogant, and cheap way the after church crowd treats waitresses for the Sunday noon meal. Compared to other customers, they are the worst. My daughter worked at a Chinese restaurant in college, and they would literally have knock-down, drag out fights about who had to work the Sunday shift. I won't tell anyone what happens to the food of the worst offenders.Click to expand...
During grad school at Wheaton College, when I was ironically studying theology, I worked at Outback Steakhouse. The money was good, but I hated having to go after church. Waiting tables can be a crushing, depressing occupation for a number of reasons. Serving Christians, especially on Sundays, was the very worst thing I ever encountered.
During grad school at Wheaton College, when I was ironically studying theology, I worked at Outback Steakhouse. The money was good, but I hated having to go after church. Waiting tables can be a crushing, depressing occupation for a number of reasons. Serving Christians, especially on Sundays, was the very worst thing I ever encountered.Click to expand...
Did you love them regardless?
Did you love them regardless?Click to expand...
I was courteous and did my job, if that's what you mean, with the exception of a couple of times when it got the best of me.
Would you say that your attitude is 100% greed based , or just somewhat over 50%?
Would you say that your attitude is 100% greed based , or just somewhat over 50%?Click to expand...
The problem most waiters and waitresses have with serving Christians is that they are generally below average tippers.
Expectations of lower income gives the waitperson a predisposition to not try so hard to please the customer and to be hypercritical of their every request or remark.
Greed has that effect on people.
Greed has that effect on people.Click to expand...
Are you saying Christians are cheap or Jerks or what? LOL:laugh:
Not worth the effort...Click to expand...
Not sure why you would take that position.
Actually, they tend to be discourteous, needy and demanding. Then they tip poorly.
I'm not sure it's greed for servers to wish to be compensated appropriately for their effort. My guess is you have a job and, if you do, you likely expect to be paid for it.
If servers are jaded (though most...if they wish to keep their jobs...will still serve as well as possible) it is the responsibility of Christians to change that reality. You would think people who had experienced grace would be more willing to reflect that to others, online or as customers.
If servers are jaded (though most...if they wish to keep their jobs...will still serve as well as possible) it is the responsibility of Christians to change that reality. You would think people who had experienced grace would be more willing to reflect that to others, online or as customers.Click to expand...
It's greed to believe you deserve a tip just because a customer walks in the door.
Believing you're not going to get one will , indeed, affect your attitude and the quality of your service.
Pigeonholeing customers, who just happen to appear in the early afternoon on Sundays as Christians who you don't believe will give you your "just reward", will affect your service towards those that you incorrectly identify as the "church crowd" and will result in less tips from those as well.
Giving you the benefit of the doubt, I'd say your opinion is based on about 50% greed and 50% poor attitude toward those you self identify on Sunday afternoon as "non-tipping and needy" Christians. Sounds like you are guilty of the same unloving and unforgiving attitude you accuse the "after church crowd" of.
It's greed to believe you deserve a tip just because a customer walks in the door.Click to expand...
I disagree but then I have waited many a table. It is plainly understood the method for compensation for having your food served to you is through the means of gratuity. To fail to do so is rude and unChristian knowing the wait staff are dependent on that for their livelyhood and it is expected. If someone has issue with tipping they should go to McDonalds or stay home.
I disagree but then I have waited many a table. It is plainly understood the method for compensation for having your food served to you is through the means of gratuity. To fail to do so is rude and unChristian knowing the wait staff are dependent on that for their livelyhood and it is expected. If someone has issue with tipping they should go to McDonalds or stay home.Click to expand...
Absolutely true. Servers are even taxed based upon an expected percentage they should receive from customers. Not tipping is actually taking money OUT of their pockets.
You're exactly right, Rev. Servers are paid a fraction of minimum wage, as low as 2.13/hr. Tipping is the industry and cultural standard. I actually once had a manager, not a great one, tell a customer who refused to tip repeatedly for no reason, "McDonald's is right down the street."
Unless one has worked this industry, it's difficult to understand what factors are at play in the mind of a server, but I can assure everyone here that a good server is, no matter what, going to give the best possible service, regardless of demographic, because that's the job and it's our chance at making any kind of wage, which is the reason we're there in the first place.
And I identify people as "unloving" and "needy" based upon their actions. Though those trends and stereotypes are there, they never hold true every time. The best possible outcome is to approach each table with a clean slate and try your best. Again, there is really no basis for "greed." Servers simply want to do a good job so that they will receive just compensation according to the industry and cultural standard. Because it's the way that the system works to the point where the law allows servers to be paid next to nothing by their employers, it is not unreasonable for servers to expect there is a fair tip to be had by every table as long as they perform their job as expected.
Another thing to remember is that servers in most restaurants don't even get to keep all of what they receive. If a restaurant also employs bussers, hosts and/or bartenders, servers will usually be required to "tip out," giving a portion of their sales to those other supporting employees. For instance, when I served at Outback, I had to "tip out" 3 percent of my total sales, regardless of the tip. So if a customer tipped the customary 15-20 percent on a $100 bill, I would get to keep 12-15 dollars. If they (as a few folks do) choose to tip 5 bucks, I get to keep 2. If they don't tip at all, I have to actually pay for the privilege of serving them. So, next time you're at a restaurant and don't have the best experience, think about if it's the server's fault or someone else's that you don't see. For instance, if your food takes long or is cold, guess what, that's rarely the server's fault. Make sure and tip accordingly. Don't make them pay.
I guess this is all to say, Christians should be less concerned with justice in these cases. It's only dinner. It's a great opportunity to show some grace to folks who probably do not know Christ and have a jaded perspective because of what they see around them.
Now stop it you two. I don't need to have you agreeing with me.:laugh:
Now stop it you two. I don't need to have you agreeing with me.:laugh:Click to expand...
Careful. This might compromise your reputation, rev!
I think a really easy doctoral dissertation is out there that examines the root causes of how a BB discussion about Christians being jerks online can, within several posts, suddenly morph into a snarling match about something fairly unrelated...e.g. tipping waits on Sundays.
Now I said it is easy because there is plenty of primary source material. The hard part is coming to a conclusion on the how and why it happens...but dissertations tend to be long on material and short on application...
Christians are jerks online.
Discussion in 'News / Current Events' started by jaigner, Jun 30, 2010.
Check this article out. I think it's pretty accurate.
I read this yesterday...I laughed and thought of, well, alot...
I think it is the same mindset of the rude, arrogant, and cheap way the after church crowd treats waitresses for the Sunday noon meal. Compared to other customers, they are the worst. My daughter worked at a Chinese restaurant in college, and they would literally have knock-down, drag out fights about who had to work the Sunday shift. I won't tell anyone what happens to the food of the worst offenders.
I guess I appreciate where this guy is coming from, maybe he has been a jerk. But if you tell people the truth, in the most loving and kind way, or just straightforward and blunt, with the all the love in your heart...your going to get called a jerk, or worse, just because they don't agree with you. So, if this guy wants to repent of his negative online attitudes toward people, well, ok. But if he is rather criticizing Christians who whether in person or online tell people they are sinners and only Jesus Christ can save them, well...then the man needs to learn the Gospel. And maybe I would be called a jerk for saying that. :laugh:
I think it is the same mindset of the rude, arrogant, and cheap way the after church crowd treats waitresses for the Sunday noon meal. Compared to other customers, they are the worst. My daughter worked at a Chinese restaurant in college, and they would literally have knock-down, drag out fights about who had to work the Sunday shift. I won't tell anyone what happens to the food of the worst offenders.Click to expand...
During grad school at Wheaton College, when I was ironically studying theology, I worked at Outback Steakhouse. The money was good, but I hated having to go after church. Waiting tables can be a crushing, depressing occupation for a number of reasons. Serving Christians, especially on Sundays, was the very worst thing I ever encountered.
During grad school at Wheaton College, when I was ironically studying theology, I worked at Outback Steakhouse. The money was good, but I hated having to go after church. Waiting tables can be a crushing, depressing occupation for a number of reasons. Serving Christians, especially on Sundays, was the very worst thing I ever encountered.Click to expand...
Did you love them regardless?
Did you love them regardless?Click to expand...
I was courteous and did my job, if that's what you mean, with the exception of a couple of times when it got the best of me.
Would you say that your attitude is 100% greed based , or just somewhat over 50%?
Would you say that your attitude is 100% greed based , or just somewhat over 50%?Click to expand...
The problem most waiters and waitresses have with serving Christians is that they are generally below average tippers.
Expectations of lower income gives the waitperson a predisposition to not try so hard to please the customer and to be hypercritical of their every request or remark.
Greed has that effect on people.
Greed has that effect on people.Click to expand...
Are you saying Christians are cheap or Jerks or what? LOL:laugh:
Not worth the effort...Click to expand...
Not sure why you would take that position.
Actually, they tend to be discourteous, needy and demanding. Then they tip poorly.
I'm not sure it's greed for servers to wish to be compensated appropriately for their effort. My guess is you have a job and, if you do, you likely expect to be paid for it.
If servers are jaded (though most...if they wish to keep their jobs...will still serve as well as possible) it is the responsibility of Christians to change that reality. You would think people who had experienced grace would be more willing to reflect that to others, online or as customers.
If servers are jaded (though most...if they wish to keep their jobs...will still serve as well as possible) it is the responsibility of Christians to change that reality. You would think people who had experienced grace would be more willing to reflect that to others, online or as customers.Click to expand...
It's greed to believe you deserve a tip just because a customer walks in the door.
Believing you're not going to get one will , indeed, affect your attitude and the quality of your service.
Pigeonholeing customers, who just happen to appear in the early afternoon on Sundays as Christians who you don't believe will give you your "just reward", will affect your service towards those that you incorrectly identify as the "church crowd" and will result in less tips from those a
s well.
Giving you the benefit of the doubt, I'd say your opinion is based on about 50% greed and 50% poor attitude toward those you self identify on Sunday afternoon as "non-tipping and needy" Christians. Sounds like you are guilty of the same unloving and unforgiving attitude you accuse the "after church crowd" of.
It's greed to believe you deserve a tip just because a customer walks in the door.Click to expand...
I disagree but then I have waited many a table. It is plainly understood the method for compensation for having your food served to you is through the means of gratuity. To fail to do so is rude and unChristian knowing the wait staff are dependent on that for their livelyhood and it is expected. If someone has issue with tipping they should go to McDonalds or stay home.
I disagree but then I have waited many a table. It is plainly understood the method for compensation for having your food served to you is through the means of gratuity. To fail to do so is rude and unChristian knowing the wait staff are dependent on that for their livelyhood and it is expected. If someone has issue with tipping they should go to McDonalds or stay home.Click to expand...
Absolutely true. Servers are even taxed based upon an expected percentage they should receive from customers. Not tipping is actually taking money OUT of their pockets.
You're exactly right, Rev. Servers are paid a fraction of minimum wage, as low as 2.13/hr. Tipping is the industry and cultural standard. I actually once had a manager, not a great one, tell a customer who refused to tip repeatedly for no reason, "McDonald's is right down the street."
Unless one has worked this industry, it's difficult to understand what factors are at play in the mind of a server, but I can assure everyone here that a good server is, no matter what, going to give the best possible service, regardless of demographic, because that's the job and it's our chance at making any kind of wage, which is the reason we're there in the first place.
And I identify people as "unloving" and "needy" based upon their actions. Though those trends and stereotypes are there, they never hold true every time. The best possible outcome is to approach each table with a clean slate and try your best. Again, there is really no basis for "greed." Servers simply want to do a good job so that they will receive just compensation according to the industry and cultural standard. Because it's the way that the system works to the point where the law allows servers to be paid next to nothing by their employers, it is not unreasonable for servers to expect there is a fair tip to be had by every table as long as they perform their job as expected.
Another thing to remember is that servers in most restaurants don't even get to keep all of what they receive. If a restaurant also employs bussers, hosts and/or bartenders, servers will usually be required to "tip out," giving a portion of their sales to those other supporting employees. For instance, when I served at Outback, I had to "tip out" 3 percent of my total sales, regardless of the tip. So if a customer tipped the customary 15-20 percent on a $100 bill, I would get to keep 12-15 dollars. If they (as a few folks do) choose to tip 5 bucks, I get to keep 2. If they don't tip at all, I have to actually pay for the privilege of serving them. So, next time you're at a restaurant and don't have the best experience, think about if it's the server's fault or someone else's that you don't see. For instance, if your food takes long or is cold, guess what, that's rarely the server's fault. Make sure and tip accordingly. Don't make them pay.
I guess this is all to say, Christians should be less concerned with justice in these cases. It's only dinner. It's a great opportunity to show some grace to folks who probably do not know Christ and have a jaded perspective because of what they see around them.
Now stop it you two. I don't need to have you agreeing with me.:laugh:
Now stop it you two. I don't need to have you agreeing with me.:laugh:Click to expand...
Careful. This might compromise your reputation, rev!
I think a really easy doctoral dissertation is out there that examines the root causes of how a BB discussion about Christians being jerks online can, within several posts, suddenly morph into a snarling match about something fairly unrelated...e.g. tipping waits on Sundays.
Now I said it is easy because there is plenty of primary source material. The hard part is coming to a conclusion on the how and why it happens...but dissertations tend to be long on material and short on application...