If there's a crap load of stuff happening with all the troll empires, please tell me that the Darkspear are going to get involved! Oh how awesome it would be to take on these troll empires, hopefully with the help of Vol'jin!
I think I understand it even better now. People are worried that you're just going to pull another Ony remake on us, that seemed to me like recycling content and I can understand why someone might be a little upset.
But, Zul'Aman and Zul'grub are more to be stories building on the previous ones, the same way that Blackwing descent and even Blackrock caverns built on the older UBRS/LBRS and Blackwing Lair. Its new content, but in an old familiar location, because the location fits the story better then a new one would, for example it would not make as much sense to put blackwing descent in outlands or northrend when we already know that Neffy has been hold up in this tower for years and years.
Hiznor <Soulbound> 110 Human Mage 13880 92 posts
03/01/2011 9:06 PMPosted by Killada
ZA has the same bosses except the last boss. Almost same trash packs.
But I'm sure they hit harder and have more hitpoints. Rehashing these is just slightly more work than ToC had to have been.
You don't HAVE to rework old content to continue a story line. You could actually build a dungeon from the ground up and continue a story line. Just seems like you are taking the easy route more often than not as of late.
Unless at some point during SFK/DM/ZA/ZG the physical location was destroyed, I don't recall any quests or other means set up to secure the locations to not allow other entities move in and fill the niches.
I'm still waiting for Heroic Kara though. Even if the current castle serves as a fortification for the Violet Eye, it was kinda slipping to another reality. Would expect this with the next expansion though, assuming it returns to the Burning Legion and Sargeras threats that still exist.
Edit for no double post: Bottom line is, some people will complain about updating old content, others will complain that the old content is going to waste and not being used. I have leveled healers using the LFG exclusively, and really wish I would have made a list of dungeons i repeated over and over, and which I never ever entered through it.
Freetherock <Interstellar Vengeance> 100 Draenei Hunter 10255 2 posts
If you would actually read lore, you would understand the point blizzard is trying to make in this post. LISTEN FOR A CHANGE DURRRRRR!!!
Impalemint <MadPensInvasionForce> 70 Human Death Knight 670 26 posts
Impalemint
i hope they bring karazhan into a 85 heroic or raid i had so much fun with that raid. as for them bringing back ZG people complained when they removed it now people are complainging that they are bringing it back. seriously stop complaining about it just be glad they are puting the raid back in. as for ZA so what they are making it a higher level big woop. yea its bad that they have to reuse their old stuff as it shows a serious lack of ingenuity and enthusiasm. just be happy they are even doing anything at all with the old raids and not just shuting them down.
if you dont like what blizzard is doing than quit your not being focred to play or pay the sub.
Zaezan <Twisted Visions> 85 Troll Shaman 1510 2532 posts
Zaezan
03/01/2011 7:00 PMPosted by Zarhym
So where is this proverbial bridge?! I'm curious to know. I'm also glad to hear about the new 5-man dungeons. I primarily pug on my characters as I don't find myself enough time to raid even though I probably could. This helps me enjoy old content revisited and revised. :D
This also makes me want to go read on the lore you speak of, and of course, the dungeons that are no longer capable of being run, but instead are becoming revamped with updated lore.
03/01/2011 9:35 PMPosted by Impalemint
I don't want them to ruin kara.
Sorry I don't wanna see that raid being remade.
or perhaps they can have a 70 and 85 setting for the raid that would make everyone happy the people who love the original (including me) and those that would like to see it progress (also me) maybe even have medev come back as a ghost oooOOOOooooOOooo or somthing
Gíg <Orgrimmar Death Squad> 87 Troll Shaman 12605 16 posts
ZG is fine but ZA shouldn't have been recycled at all, it is the same bosses, same fights, same map just 85, theres a completely untouched zone very few even noticed called Tor'Watha and yes theres a lonely instance portal there
As I said in earlier posts in this thread I don't think it's really an issue of these places coming back or re-visited, It feels (to me at least reading most of the posts) is the way Blizz really went about it, I think a LOT of people were expecting the 1st major content out of the gate to be 2-3 totally NEW things, not something that was out before.
Blizz did error a bit here I think if the focus on 4.1 had been about the new totally new instance I think it would have gone over better, plus I think these should have divided up liek I said earlier 4.1 = 2 new, + ZA, 4.2 = 2 new + ZG, I think that would have gone over much better with people.
Zul'Aman is in Ghostlands, which is in Azeroth, not Outland. It's true Ghostlands didn't receive any terrain changes after the Cataclysm, but that doesn't mean the remaining Amani are unaffected by what's happened.
can you tell us how Ghostlands is in Azeroth but not Outland when before Cata came around you could go around tirisfal to north of EPL and nothing was there but water? Ghostlands is instanced (when on a flight path there you go thru the instance thingy), there's nothing north of EPL but water. Isn't that instance considered Outland? I'm confused.
Cornbééf <is ignoring you> 35 Tauren Paladin 480 9 posts
The world around these recycled instances changed completely yet for some reason the instance layout stays intact....i can deal with sfk being the same after cata, but deadmines? its a freaking mine, a big earthquake just hapepend that split zones nearby in half yet deadmines retains its original look????? Lazy if you ask me.
Neyus 58 Undead Death Knight 130 1912 posts
People are just mad because they want affection from blizz and think they're not getting it
Tairuu 85 Tauren Paladin 1430 62 posts
Tairuu
03/01/2011 9:48 PMPosted by Ryooni
can you tell us how Ghostlands is in Azeroth but not Outland when before Cata came around you could go around tirisfal to north of EPL and nothing was there but water?
Freyacresent <Oath> 82 Orc Death Knight 5345 1911 posts
03/01/2011 7:57 PMPosted by Flayre
Yes I'm going to be dumb and read between the lines...but i'm picking up the strong scent of a Troll Raid in our near future.
We ARE due for one. Wrath didn't have a troll raid, just 2 troll 5 mans.
Rathpriest <Rônin> 85 Dwarf Priest 2475 968 posts
Rathpriest
Considering that past 5 mans in patches (Ulduar, ToC, ICC) were related to the raids in those patches, I assume the other (non-Firelands) raid in the patch is Troll themed.
If there's a crap load of stuff happening with all the troll empires, please tell me that the Darkspear are going to get involved! Oh how awesome it would be to take on these troll empires, hopefully with the help of Vol'jin!
I think I understand it even better now. People are worried that you're just going to pull another Ony remake on us, that seemed to me like recycling content and I can understand why someone might be a little upset.
But, Zul'Aman and Zul'grub are more to be stories building on the previous ones, the same way that Blackwing descent and even Blackrock caverns built on the older UBRS/LBRS and Blackwing Lair. Its new content, but in an old familiar location, because the location fits the story better then a new one would, for example it would not make as much sense to put blackwing descent in outlands or northrend when we already know that Neffy has been hold up in this tower for years and years.
Hiznor <Soulbound> 110 Human Mage 13880 92 posts
03/01/2011 9:06 PMPosted by Killada
ZA has the same bosses except the last boss. Almost same trash packs.
But I'm sure they hit harder and have more hitpoints. Rehashing these is just slightly more work than ToC had to have been.
You don't HAVE to rework old content to continue a story line. You could actually build a dungeon from the ground up and continue a story line. Just seems like you are taking the easy route more often than not as of late.
Unless at some point during SFK/DM/ZA/ZG the physical location was destroyed, I don't recall any quests or other means set up to secure the locations to not allow other entities move in and fill the niches.
I'm still waiting for Heroic Kara though. Even if the current castle serves as a fortification for the Violet Eye, it was kinda slipping to another reality. Would expect this with the next expansion though, assuming it returns to the Burning Legion and Sargeras threats that still exist.
Edit for no double post: Bottom line is, some people will complain about updating old content, others will complain that the old content is going to waste and not being used. I have leveled healers using the LFG exclusively, and really wish I would have made a list of dungeons i repeated over and over, and which I never ever entered through it.
Freetherock <Interstellar Vengeance> 100 Draenei Hunter 10255 2 posts
If you would actually read lore, you would understand the point blizzard is trying to make in this post. LISTEN FOR A CHANGE DURRRRRR!!!
Impalemint <MadPensInvasionForce> 70 Human Death Knight 670 26 posts
Impalemint
i hope they bring karazhan into a 85 heroic or raid i had so much fun with that raid. as for them bringing back ZG people complained when they removed it now people are complainging that they are bringing it back. seriously stop complaining about it just be glad they are puting the raid back in. as for ZA so what they are making it a higher level big woop. yea its bad that they have to reuse their old stuff as it shows a serious lack of ingenuity and enthusiasm. just be happy they are even doing anything at all with the old raids and not just shuting them down.
if you dont like what blizzard is doing than quit your not being focred to play or pay the sub.
Zaezan <Twisted Visions> 85 Troll Shaman 1510 2532 posts
Zaezan
03/01/2011 7:00 PMPosted by Zarhym
So where is this proverbial bridge?! I'm curious to know. I'm also glad to hear about the new 5-man dungeons. I primarily pug on my characters as I don't fin
d myself enough time to raid even though I probably could. This helps me enjoy old content revisited and revised. :D
This also makes me want to go read on the lore you speak of, and of course, the dungeons that are no longer capable of being run, but instead are becoming revamped with updated lore.
03/01/2011 9:35 PMPosted by Impalemint
I don't want them to ruin kara.
Sorry I don't wanna see that raid being remade.
or perhaps they can have a 70 and 85 setting for the raid that would make everyone happy the people who love the original (including me) and those that would like to see it progress (also me) maybe even have medev come back as a ghost oooOOOOooooOOooo or somthing
Gíg <Orgrimmar Death Squad> 87 Troll Shaman 12605 16 posts
ZG is fine but ZA shouldn't have been recycled at all, it is the same bosses, same fights, same map just 85, theres a completely untouched zone very few even noticed called Tor'Watha and yes theres a lonely instance portal there
As I said in earlier posts in this thread I don't think it's really an issue of these places coming back or re-visited, It feels (to me at least reading most of the posts) is the way Blizz really went about it, I think a LOT of people were expecting the 1st major content out of the gate to be 2-3 totally NEW things, not something that was out before.
Blizz did error a bit here I think if the focus on 4.1 had been about the new totally new instance I think it would have gone over better, plus I think these should have divided up liek I said earlier 4.1 = 2 new, + ZA, 4.2 = 2 new + ZG, I think that would have gone over much better with people.
Zul'Aman is in Ghostlands, which is in Azeroth, not Outland. It's true Ghostlands didn't receive any terrain changes after the Cataclysm, but that doesn't mean the remaining Amani are unaffected by what's happened.
can you tell us how Ghostlands is in Azeroth but not Outland when before Cata came around you could go around tirisfal to north of EPL and nothing was there but water? Ghostlands is instanced (when on a flight path there you go thru the instance thingy), there's nothing north of EPL but water. Isn't that instance considered Outland? I'm confused.
Cornbééf <is ignoring you> 35 Tauren Paladin 480 9 posts
The world around these recycled instances changed completely yet for some reason the instance layout stays intact....i can deal with sfk being the same after cata, but deadmines? its a freaking mine, a big earthquake just hapepend that split zones nearby in half yet deadmines retains its original look????? Lazy if you ask me.
Neyus 58 Undead Death Knight 130 1912 posts
People are just mad because they want affection from blizz and think they're not getting it
Tairuu 85 Tauren Paladin 1430 62 posts
Tairuu
03/01/2011 9:48 PMPosted by Ryooni
can you tell us how Ghostlands is in Azeroth but not Outland when before Cata came around you could go around tirisfal to north of EPL and nothing was there but water?
Freyacresent <Oath> 82 Orc Death Knight 5345 1911 posts
03/01/2011 7:57 PMPosted by Flayre
Yes I'm going to be dumb and read between the lines...but i'm picking up the strong scent of a Troll Raid in our near future.
We ARE due for one. Wrath didn't have a troll raid, just 2 troll 5 mans.
Rathpriest <Rônin> 85 Dwarf Priest 2475 968 posts
Rathpriest
Considering that past 5 mans in patches (Ulduar, ToC, ICC) were related to the raids in those patches, I assume the other (non-Firelands) raid in the patch is Troll themed.