ongoing mass shootings thread - Page 68 - U2 Feedback
06-20-2016, 08:00 PM #1006
I'm talking about the NRA. They're a highly organized terrorist group that does everything in their power to get as many guns on the streets as possible. If they flood the streets and loosen the laws they know the guns will get in the hands of the mentally ill, the desperate, and the angry and we'll have more mass shootings. Then they can strike fear in you so that you keep arming yourself. Sales rise. And then they convince you that responsible and logical laws that most thinking people want are moves to "take your guns". They're using the American people as pawns.
06-20-2016, 08:33 PM #1007
Fair enough. Posted my message before you edited yours to include "American" and changed the original quote you were responding to.
06-20-2016, 08:40 PM #1008
I didn't edit anything, those were two separate posts.
06-20-2016, 08:55 PM #1009
Oops, you're right on that.
In that case, should the federal government redact documents when they decide doing otherwise would scare the stupid, easily swayed proletariat?
06-20-2016, 09:06 PM #1010
Even from the perspective of a hardened gun nut, I don't understand the logic that it ought to be easier for a person on a terrorist watch list to buy an assault rifle than to hop on a plane to visit their sick mother or whatever.
06-20-2016, 09:14 PM #1011
I definitely understand where you're coming from. Nine times out of ten, these days, I find myself on the side of gun control activists.
However, this time I'm a little unsure. There are nearly no rules for how one ends up on the no fly list. Anecdotally, I have an associate who has been involved in Muslim civil rights movements. He's told many stories of how easy it is to find yourself on the no fly list, if you're involved in organizations the government simply doesn't like.
06-20-2016, 09:16 PM #1012
https://twitter.com/ggreenwald/statu...50768688955392
Even pro-gun control figures like Glenn Greenwald are a little slow to accept the terror watch list bans.
06-20-2016, 09:18 PM #1013
Wouldn't that suggest the processes and criteria of adding people to no-fly and similar lists is flawed and should be revised, not that people under genuine suspicion of terroristic sympathies should be permitted to purchase high-powered weaponry?
Moreover, correct me if I'm wrong, but in the States I would arouse some form of suspicion if I rather obviously went about buying the ingredients for a bomb, but nobody will bat an eyelid if I buy a gun capable of murdering fifty people in a single event.
06-20-2016, 09:21 PM #1014
the NRA is a terrorist organization and its members of Congress who do its bidding in exchange for their blood money are actively aiding and abetting terrorist behavior.
06-20-2016, 09:30 PM #1015
When did anyone infer that?
But in this instance redaction made since. But because they caved into Ryan they basically gave ISIS another notch in their headboard they don't deserve. Between this and Trump they're just handing them recruitment tools.
06-20-2016, 09:33 PM #1016
I don't disagree with you. Ideally, we need some codified system for placing people on these lists, and we need to do all we can to at least make carrying out whatever nefarious plans they have as difficult as possible.
But, at the same time, I strongly sympathize with anyone who is slow to simply give the government the power to use these lists to restrict rights while hoping that, at some later date, the system is fixed. The system has to be fixed first.
Really, this would be the same as the Patriot Act. Is it reasonable to listen in on private citizens' conversations if we have reasonable suspicion that they plan to commit a terrorist act? Of course. But, when given the power to apply "reasonable suspicion" liberally, the government didn't exactly show their ability to behave responsibly.
I understand the desire to not get burned again.
06-20-2016, 09:33 PM #1017
On an unrelated note, I'd just like to know how many of the politicians who've voted against gun control measures also claim to be so pro-life, to the point where they support uber-restrictive abortion laws or the shutting down of Planned Parenthood. If there's any overlap, I'd like to see that particular hypocrisy called out a hell of a lot more often.
06-20-2016, 09:37 PM #1018
they basically gave ISIS another notch in their headboard they don't deserve.
so by "the terrorists win," you were indeed referring to ISIS, not the NRA, as I originally implied.
Why make life difficult by denying this in the first place?
Additionally, if that is your logic, why would you not support the idea of being "hush hush" about the British assassin's cry of "Britain first"? Applying your logic, revealing this would give the Fascist Right an underserved notch in their headboard.
Yet, if the right wing David Cameron would've done this, what do you suspect the international reaction would've been?
06-20-2016, 09:38 PM #1019
Honestly, the Republicans were strategically stupid too on this one; now they can't blame Obama's or Clinton's FBI for dropping the ball.
06-20-2016, 09:45 PM #1020
The first one was referring to ISIS, hence the context of the article posted. The second was the NRA. The context of your post referenced the far right so I assumed you were talking about my American terrorist post. Simple as that.
ongoing mass shootings thread - Page 68 - U2 Feedback
06-20-2016, 08:00 PM #1006
I'm talking about the NRA. They're a highly organized terrorist group that does everything in their power to get as many guns on the streets as possible. If they flood the streets and loosen the laws they know the guns will get in the hands of the mentally ill, the desperate, and the angry and we'll have more mass shootings. Then they can strike fear in you so that you keep arming yourself. Sales rise. And then they convince you that responsible and logical laws that most thinking people want are moves to "take your guns". They're using the American people as pawns.
06-20-2016, 08:33 PM #1007
Fair enough. Posted my message before you edited yours to include "American" and changed the original quote you were responding to.
06-20-2016, 08:40 PM #1008
I didn't edit anything, those were two separate posts.
06-20-2016, 08:55 PM #1009
Oops, you're right on that.
In that case, should the federal government redact documents when they decide doing otherwise would scare the stupid, easily swayed proletariat?
06-20-2016, 09:06 PM #1010
Even from the perspective of a hardened gun nut, I don't understand the logic that it ought to be easier for a person on a terrorist watch list to buy an assault rifle than to hop on a plane to visit their sick mother or whatever.
06-20-2016, 09:14 PM #1011
I definitely understand where you're coming from. Nine times out of ten, these days, I find myself on the side of gun control activists.
However, this time I'm a little unsure. There are nearly no rules for how one ends up on the no fly list. Anecdotally, I have an associate who has been involved in Muslim civil rights movements. He's told many stories of how easy it is to find yourself on the no fly list, if you're involved in organizations the government simply doesn't like.
06-20-2016, 09:16 PM #1012
https://twitter.com/ggreenwald/statu...50768688955392
Even pro-gun control figures like Glenn Greenwald are a little slow to accept the terror watch list bans.
06-20-2016, 09:18 PM #1013
Wouldn't that suggest the processes and criteria of adding people to no-fly and similar lists is flawed and should be revised, not that people under genuine suspicion of terroristic sympathies should be permitted to purchase high-powered weaponry?
Moreover, correct me if I'm wrong, but in the States I would arouse some form of suspicion if I rather obviously went about buying the ingredients for a bomb, but nobody will bat an eyelid if I buy a gun capable of murdering fifty people in a single event.
06-20-2016, 09:21 PM #1014
the NRA is a terrorist organization and its members of Congress who do its biddi
ng in exchange for their blood money are actively aiding and abetting terrorist behavior.
06-20-2016, 09:30 PM #1015
When did anyone infer that?
But in this instance redaction made since. But because they caved into Ryan they basically gave ISIS another notch in their headboard they don't deserve. Between this and Trump they're just handing them recruitment tools.
06-20-2016, 09:33 PM #1016
I don't disagree with you. Ideally, we need some codified system for placing people on these lists, and we need to do all we can to at least make carrying out whatever nefarious plans they have as difficult as possible.
But, at the same time, I strongly sympathize with anyone who is slow to simply give the government the power to use these lists to restrict rights while hoping that, at some later date, the system is fixed. The system has to be fixed first.
Really, this would be the same as the Patriot Act. Is it reasonable to listen in on private citizens' conversations if we have reasonable suspicion that they plan to commit a terrorist act? Of course. But, when given the power to apply "reasonable suspicion" liberally, the government didn't exactly show their ability to behave responsibly.
I understand the desire to not get burned again.
06-20-2016, 09:33 PM #1017
On an unrelated note, I'd just like to know how many of the politicians who've voted against gun control measures also claim to be so pro-life, to the point where they support uber-restrictive abortion laws or the shutting down of Planned Parenthood. If there's any overlap, I'd like to see that particular hypocrisy called out a hell of a lot more often.
06-20-2016, 09:37 PM #1018
they basically gave ISIS another notch in their headboard they don't deserve.
so by "the terrorists win," you were indeed referring to ISIS, not the NRA, as I originally implied.
Why make life difficult by denying this in the first place?
Additionally, if that is your logic, why would you not support the idea of being "hush hush" about the British assassin's cry of "Britain first"? Applying your logic, revealing this would give the Fascist Right an underserved notch in their headboard.
Yet, if the right wing David Cameron would've done this, what do you suspect the international reaction would've been?
06-20-2016, 09:38 PM #1019
Honestly, the Republicans were strategically stupid too on this one; now they can't blame Obama's or Clinton's FBI for dropping the ball.
06-20-2016, 09:45 PM #1020
The first one was referring to ISIS, hence the context of the article posted. The second was the NRA. The context of your post referenced the far right so I assumed you were talking about my American terrorist post. Simple as that.